Hi Raimundas, This is the correct list to discuss about address policies, not about if RIPE should or shouldnt accept Crimea as Russia or Ukraine. In this list we dont set the legal/law questions about RIPE. The person interested if RIPE will/wont take LIRs with paper from Crimea, Russia or Crimea, Ukraine should ask directly to RIPE. As Michiel wrote before: http://www.ripe.net/lir-services/ncc/contact Then ask there your question. Here we cant help you on that. Best Regards, El 29/07/2014 11:31, Raimundas Tuminauskas escribió:
Dear all,
Its just my couple of cents, please disregard if you feel this inappropriate
1. The problem raised by Max is deeper. It concerns two properties with the way Internet resources are distributed: a) some independence from the national governments, and b) neutrality. These principles have enabled the proliferation of the Internet globally. Internet being an alternative ITU-independent, community-driven etc. blah blah we all know it. 2. Neutrality as well as freedom of information would be more useful to the oppressor at any conflict situation. There are situations where these have to be challenged and questioned over and over. Its because "neutrality" in some cases could be seen as a collaboration with the occupant or worse - a silent participation in a crime. Question is whenever there should be a special policy in such cases for allocation of resources, or current set of policies are sufficient enough. 3. Paradoxically, neutrality, availability of international resources like Internet connectivity, and objective information in the grey zones of conflicts and disputes are the only counter-measures against the propaganda of whichever side.
So yes, IMHO it is an appropriate forum to discuss the current set of policies of distribution of Internet resources in the light of current situation.
LIR registration policy requires "The legal, registered address of your organization" to be provided. If RIPE NCC or any RIR will consider "Sevastopol, Russia" a legal address of the company, then it creates a precedent for even less favorable "legal" addresses. The same should apply to the change of legal address, reallocation of resources, etc. On the other hand denial of change will essentially void the functionality of LIR. Requests for allocation of resources for the region by the legal (not "legal") entity, e.g. existing registered LIR shall be processed normally.
There is no good answer in these cases.
-----Original Message----- From: address-policy-wg-bounces@ripe.net [mailto:address-policy-wg-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Daniel Baeza (Red y Sistemas TVT) Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2014 11:10 AM To: address-policy-wg@ripe.net Subject: Re: [address-policy-wg] [ncc-services-wg] Crimea papers
Hi all,
Dont get me wrong, but Is this list the correct one to discuss about if Crimea is or isnt part of Russia or Ukranie. If the Crimea ppl decided to be or forced to be part of Russia?
I think we shouldnt take part in a politic discussion, even more when this list only references to Address Policy, not RIPE politics.
Kseniya wrote:
Gert Doering,
Just one question. Will RIPE NCC acept these documents or not?
If yes, that will show that European words means nothing. And words >are not backed up by actions.
Im NOT answering in name of Gert, but I think Gert dont have the answer to that. Remember, this is the ADDRESS POLICY, not the RIPE POLITICS working group.
Best Regards,
-Daniel
El 29/07/2014 9:33, Gert Doering escribió:
Hi,
On Tue, Jul 29, 2014 at 02:53:52AM +0300, Dmitriy Zemlyanoy wrote:
Depending which media outlet you decide to believe, crimean people decided to be part of Russia
This is wrong statement. Not Crimea people decided, but Russian soldiers. Probably you know that nobody in the world accept the results of referendum under machine guns.
If you quote me, quote me completely, do not cut off the second half, otherwise it's not useful discussing with you.
I did present a balanced view *BECAUSE* it is hard to understand from the outside what exactly happened there, without having been there, as it's not clear which reports are trustworthy and which are not. Both sides use the media to spread propaganda.
Gert Doering -- NetMaster
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-- Daniel Baeza Centro de Observación de Red Dpto. Red y Sistemas Television Costa Blanca S.L. Telf. 966.190.847 | Fax. 965.074.390 http://www.tvt.es | http://www.tvt-datos.es Correo: d.baeza@tvt-datos.es -- [Atención] La información contenida en este e-mail es confidencial, privilegiada y está dirigida exclusivamente a su destinatario. Cualquier revisión, difusión, distribución o copiado de este mensaje sin autorización del propietario está prohibido. Si ha recibido este e-mail por error por favor bórrelo y envíe un mensaje al remitente. [Disclaimer] The information contained in this e-mail is privileged and confidential and is intended only for its addressee. Any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is prohibited. If you have received it in error please delete the original message and e-mail us. (!) El medio ambiente es responsabilidad de todos. Imprime este mail si es absolutamente necesario.