Regarding information manipulation, regarding the situation with the transfer of IP addresses on the territory of Ukraine.
Здравствуйте, . Dear colleagues, my name is Oleksandr Fedienko. I think it's not every day that parliamentarians write to you here, but considering that recently I have been mentioned quite often in correspondence, I want to write something from myself. A little about myself, I started working for an internet company around 1993 and have worked in the digital communications industry all my life. I have personally built many Internet companies, am a certified expert in cyber security, OSINT, have four higher education degrees, and now have a master's degree in law. For five years in a row, he was elected to the Internet Association of Ukraine, becoming the chairman of the board, and defending the interests of our industry. This is so that you, dear community, have an idea about my competence. I am sure that many people know that Ukraine is currently defending its territory from an armed attack by Russia. We defend on all fronts, on the battlefield with small arms, internationally, I was recently at the MCE in Bucharest, and we also defend our cyber space. Cyber attacks are constantly taking place on enterprises of our critical infrastructure, our information space is overflowing with Russian propaganda and phishing scammers who are trying to extort the last money from the citizens of Ukraine. That is why we introduce various mechanisms to protect our cyberspace. At one time, the operators themselves proposed to block all AS of Russian operators. This is a separate topic for discussion, but the information domen RU that affected the citizens of our country has practically disappeared from the Internet space of Ukraine. Regarding the topic of blocking transfers of IP addresses according to the mechanisms that will be introduced by RIPE NCC. Unfortunately, in addition to the fact that we need to take care of the security of our cyberspace, we already have cases when IP addresses, in the occupied territories of Ukraine, which are routed in the networks of Ukrainian operators, begin to be re-issued to other companies. I also want to remind you that the war is going on throughout the territory of Ukraine. Our people throughout Ukraine are under constant 24/7 rocket fire. Therefore, it is impossible to separate one thing. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that we expect that there may also be a military intervention from the side of Belarus, so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine. I apologize to the community for the long text, maybe emotional in some cities, but definitely not from a bot account. I don't know why a person who escaped from a country where Russian missiles or Iranian drones fly every day is trying to deceive the RIPE NCC community. Connecting through an outdated mechanism for expressing the opinion of their bots. Analyzing some texts, I see that they were written by the same person, somewhat rearranging the words, but under different emails. I want to draw attention to the instructions for bots that Mr. Maksym is currently promoting, which is used to form the opinion of a supposedly community from Ukraine. And also on the not quite modern mechanism of digital information exchange on the platform of RIPE NCC. «We still have a chance to stop the robber. You have to work with his own methods. To do this, subscribe to the ncc-services-wg mailing list here https://www.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ncc-services-wg/ And write there that these figures do not represent the Ukrainian community, but represent «exclusively their own selfish interests. They are trying to accuse me of some kind of financial schemes. If the person Maksym Tulyev really possesses such information according to the rules of a civilized society, he should report it to the Ukrainian law enforcement agencies. I'm even ready to take a polygraph with this person, which is true, then he needs to return to the country where the missiles fly. In summary, apart from the issue of the security of Ukrainian cyberspace, we do not intend to express any other opinions. I am sure that RIPE NCC will listen to the position of the public, namely those companies of residents of Ukraine that work on the territory of Ukraine. I hope that until RIPE NCC implements a secure transfer of IP addresses, all transfers on the territory of Ukraine will be closed. I ask the RIPE NCC community to explain to LIR that IP addresses are not their property, they have acquired the right to use them on the basis. The fact is that now Mr. Maksym is trying to introduce the idea that IP addresses are goods and property that can be the subject of financial trading. I would like to thank Mr. Ondrej Filip for your position, which you expressed at the profile meeting of Telecom Ukraine. «Max and A.F., please, I am not a judge. I can read your emails, but do not expect my involvement. And also keep in mind, during the NCC services WG I promised, that EB will consider some temporarily solution. The mood in the room was supporting this. However some the final policy must be decided by «the community. I hope that RIPE NCC will find security mechanisms, this is how Ukraine conducts war, and we will defend ourselves on all fronts, even in cyberspace. I would like to remind you that legally martial law has been imposed on the territory of Ukraine. Currently, rules are being developed for state institutions using IP addresses, but so far only for state institutions. We are waging war against a country whose size is 28 times larger than our state, whose population is 4 times larger than ours, whose military potential is many times greater than our capabilities. We wage war on land, in the air, at sea, in cyberspace, and more. We are not at war for 8 months, but for 8 years and 8 months. All this testifies to our resilience, courage to defend our own and thirst to win. Would other countries withstand such pressure? Today alone, the enemy fired 55 Kh-101 cruise missiles and one Kh-59 guided air missile, 22 S-300 anti-aircraft missiles, 4 Shahid-136 UAVs and one Lancet-3 UAV at civilian targets in Ukraine. I don't know how, but we are holding on, regrouping, building up reserves, strengthening defenses and gradually liberating our homeland. Victory is given to us very hard. But she will definitely be. With respect to RIPE NCC Fedienko Oleksandr
Hi All, 01.11.22 08:13, FAP_IMC пише:
Здравствуйте, . The Great Patriot begins his speech in Russian. Nice.
Dear colleagues, my name is Oleksandr Fedienko. I think it's not every day that parliamentarians write to you here, but considering that recently I have been mentioned quite often in correspondence, I want to write something from myself.
A little about myself, I started working for an internet company around 1993 and have worked in the digital communications industry all my life. I have personally built many Internet companies, am a certified expert in cyber security, OSINT, have four higher education degrees, and now have a master's degree in law.
For five years in a row, he was elected to the Internet Association of Ukraine, becoming the chairman of the board, and defending the interests of our industry. This is so that you, dear community, have an idea about my competence.
I agree you have deep professional knowledge. That's true. And that's really scare me because of the way you use this knowledge. You was the author or the notorious law draft about the IMEI database, which forces mobile operators to stop serving mobile devices does not listed in your database. All the market was against it, and it was very difficult for us to stop it. You was the author of the first draft of the law for electronic communications. Of course, your lovely IMEI registry was included there, as well as obliging ISPs to install the government-controlled devices for censorship and surveillance (same as Russia has SORM-3 and TSPU). And in general to expand ancient, bureaucratic and bribery-based telco regulatory to the Internet. A huge work was done by InAU and other NGOs to clean that shit out. Now you are trying to return it back to that law step by step by amendments, as during the war time it is very difficult to work for NGOs and human right activists in Ukraine. Also you forget to mention your third new education you got after elected to the parliament. You are really excellent in it. You are master of lie, disinformation and manipulation. I will show some good examples below.
Unfortunately, in addition to the fact that we need to take care of the security of our cyberspace, we already have cases when IP addresses, in the occupied territories of Ukraine, which are routed in the networks of Ukrainian operators, begin to be re-issued to other companies.
Yes. There are transfers from the territory in distress. But there are NO FACTS of ANY forced transfer. This is your manipulation.
I would like to draw your attention to the fact that we expect that there may also be a military intervention from the side of Belarus, so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine.
Manipulation. Yes, we afraid of intervention from Belarus. But there is NO LOGICAL LINK, nothing to do with "so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine". You try to make a EMOTIONAL link between these two sentences and let it change the logical link. Like in media manipulation handbooks, yes?
I want to draw attention to the instructions for bots that Mr. Maksym is currently promoting, which is used to form the opinion of a supposedly community from Ukraine. And also on the not quite modern mechanism of digital information exchange on the platform of RIPE NCC.
Lie. These people are not bots. These are real IP resource holders (it can be easily checked by NCC staff with e-mails) that I woke up. They are scare now, and write what they are afraid of. And of course, I will try to wake up more people whom you try to rob. Meanwhile, as we can see, your bots can only do a cut and paste.
I hope that until RIPE NCC implements a secure transfer of IP addresses, all transfers on the territory of Ukraine will be closed.
Manipulation. RIPE NCC due diligence is secure enough now. There was no evidences for any forced transfer inside Ukraine. And for 1000% sure it is not a common situation that is too serious to close all Ukrainian transfers. And for the last, I will remind your behavior, such as the style of your language and public treats as we found out not only to me. I don't know was it enough to be a crime in Europe, but for sure in any European country you will be kicked out with disgrace from the parliament just next day.
Hi everyone, In fact, as Artem and Maxim Tulyev said, the threat of physical violence may exist. I would like to show you communication history in the Ukrainian Telecommunication community which is called "Telecom Ukraine" ( Of course these messages have already been deleted. But we have a grateful option - screenshot.) Here is the screenshot Let me translate what's going on in this screenshot. That's what Alexandr Glushchenko said: RIPE is "an apolitical" organization, but for the money. When the Russians will be shelling Amsterdam, I want to believe in the permanence of their course. And that's what Olexandr Fedienko replied to his message: "I am already looking forward to it" Oleksandr Fedienko is a people's deputy of Ukraine, member of the Committee of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine. Alexandr Glushchenko is a former Ukrainian Internet Association board member. [image.png] ------- Original Message ------- On Tuesday, November 1st, 2022 at 4:56 PM, Max Tulyev maxtul@netassist.ua wrote:
Hi All,
01.11.22 08:13, FAP_IMC пише:
Здравствуйте, .
The Great Patriot begins his speech in Russian. Nice.
Dear colleagues, my name is Oleksandr Fedienko. I think it's not every day that parliamentarians write to you here, but considering that recently I have been mentioned quite often in correspondence, I want to write something from myself.
A little about myself, I started working for an internet company around 1993 and have worked in the digital communications industry all my life. I have personally built many Internet companies, am a certified expert in cyber security, OSINT, have four higher education degrees, and now have a master's degree in law.
For five years in a row, he was elected to the Internet Association of Ukraine, becoming the chairman of the board, and defending the interests of our industry. This is so that you, dear community, have an idea about my competence.
I agree you have deep professional knowledge. That's true. And that's really scare me because of the way you use this knowledge.
You was the author or the notorious law draft about the IMEI database, which forces mobile operators to stop serving mobile devices does not listed in your database. All the market was against it, and it was very difficult for us to stop it.
You was the author of the first draft of the law for electronic communications. Of course, your lovely IMEI registry was included there, as well as obliging ISPs to install the government-controlled devices for censorship and surveillance (same as Russia has SORM-3 and TSPU). And in general to expand ancient, bureaucratic and bribery-based telco regulatory to the Internet. A huge work was done by InAU and other NGOs to clean that shit out. Now you are trying to return it back to that law step by step by amendments, as during the war time it is very difficult to work for NGOs and human right activists in Ukraine.
Also you forget to mention your third new education you got after elected to the parliament. You are really excellent in it. You are master of lie, disinformation and manipulation. I will show some good examples below.
Unfortunately, in addition to the fact that we need to take care of the security of our cyberspace, we already have cases when IP addresses, in the occupied territories of Ukraine, which are routed in the networks of Ukrainian operators, begin to be re-issued to other companies.
Yes. There are transfers from the territory in distress. But there are NO FACTS of ANY forced transfer. This is your manipulation.
I would like to draw your attention to the fact that we expect that there may also be a military intervention from the side of Belarus, so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine.
Manipulation. Yes, we afraid of intervention from Belarus. But there is NO LOGICAL LINK, nothing to do with "so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine". You try to make a EMOTIONAL link between these two sentences and let it change the logical link. Like in media manipulation handbooks, yes?
I want to draw attention to the instructions for bots that Mr. Maksym is currently promoting, which is used to form the opinion of a supposedly community from Ukraine. And also on the not quite modern mechanism of digital information exchange on the platform of RIPE NCC.
Lie. These people are not bots. These are real IP resource holders (it can be easily checked by NCC staff with e-mails) that I woke up. They are scare now, and write what they are afraid of.
And of course, I will try to wake up more people whom you try to rob.
Meanwhile, as we can see, your bots can only do a cut and paste.
I hope that until RIPE NCC implements a secure transfer of IP addresses, all transfers on the territory of Ukraine will be closed.
Manipulation. RIPE NCC due diligence is secure enough now. There was no evidences for any forced transfer inside Ukraine. And for 1000% sure it is not a common situation that is too serious to close all Ukrainian transfers.
And for the last, I will remind your behavior, such as the style of your language and public treats as we found out not only to me. I don't know was it enough to be a crime in Europe, but for sure in any European country you will be kicked out with disgrace from the parliament just next day.
--
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, get a password reminder, or change your subscription options, please visit: https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ncc-services-wg
I'm sorry, I forgot to attach the screenshot. ------- Original Message ------- On Tuesday, November 1st, 2022 at 5:18 PM, bravephoenixbird via ncc-services-wg <ncc-services-wg@ripe.net> wrote:
Hi everyone,
In fact, as Artem and Maxim Tulyev said, the threat of physical violence may exist.
I would like to show you communication history in the Ukrainian Telecommunication community which is called "Telecom Ukraine" ( Of course these messages have already been deleted. But we have a grateful option - screenshot.)
Here is the screenshot
Let me translate what's going on in this screenshot.
That's what Alexandr Glushchenko said: RIPE is "an apolitical" organization, but for the money. When the Russians will be shelling Amsterdam, I want to believe in the permanence of their course.
And that's what Olexandr Fedienko replied to his message: "I am already looking forward to it"
Oleksandr Fedienko is a people's deputy of Ukraine, member of the Committee of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine. Alexandr Glushchenko is a former Ukrainian Internet Association board member.
[image.png]
------- Original Message ------- On Tuesday, November 1st, 2022 at 4:56 PM, Max Tulyev maxtul@netassist.ua wrote:
Hi All,
01.11.22 08:13, FAP_IMC пише:
Здравствуйте, .
The Great Patriot begins his speech in Russian. Nice.
Dear colleagues, my name is Oleksandr Fedienko. I think it's not every day that parliamentarians write to you here, but considering that recently I have been mentioned quite often in correspondence, I want to write something from myself.
A little about myself, I started working for an internet company around 1993 and have worked in the digital communications industry all my life. I have personally built many Internet companies, am a certified expert in cyber security, OSINT, have four higher education degrees, and now have a master's degree in law.
For five years in a row, he was elected to the Internet Association of Ukraine, becoming the chairman of the board, and defending the interests of our industry. This is so that you, dear community, have an idea about my competence.
I agree you have deep professional knowledge. That's true. And that's really scare me because of the way you use this knowledge.
You was the author or the notorious law draft about the IMEI database, which forces mobile operators to stop serving mobile devices does not listed in your database. All the market was against it, and it was very difficult for us to stop it.
You was the author of the first draft of the law for electronic communications. Of course, your lovely IMEI registry was included there, as well as obliging ISPs to install the government-controlled devices for censorship and surveillance (same as Russia has SORM-3 and TSPU). And in general to expand ancient, bureaucratic and bribery-based telco regulatory to the Internet. A huge work was done by InAU and other NGOs to clean that shit out. Now you are trying to return it back to that law step by step by amendments, as during the war time it is very difficult to work for NGOs and human right activists in Ukraine.
Also you forget to mention your third new education you got after elected to the parliament. You are really excellent in it. You are master of lie, disinformation and manipulation. I will show some good examples below.
Unfortunately, in addition to the fact that we need to take care of the security of our cyberspace, we already have cases when IP addresses, in the occupied territories of Ukraine, which are routed in the networks of Ukrainian operators, begin to be re-issued to other companies.
Yes. There are transfers from the territory in distress. But there are NO FACTS of ANY forced transfer. This is your manipulation.
I would like to draw your attention to the fact that we expect that there may also be a military intervention from the side of Belarus, so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine.
Manipulation. Yes, we afraid of intervention from Belarus. But there is NO LOGICAL LINK, nothing to do with "so the transfer blocking mechanisms IP adress should be in place throughout Ukraine". You try to make a EMOTIONAL link between these two sentences and let it change the logical link. Like in media manipulation handbooks, yes?
I want to draw attention to the instructions for bots that Mr. Maksym is currently promoting, which is used to form the opinion of a supposedly community from Ukraine. And also on the not quite modern mechanism of digital information exchange on the platform of RIPE NCC.
Lie. These people are not bots. These are real IP resource holders (it can be easily checked by NCC staff with e-mails) that I woke up. They are scare now, and write what they are afraid of.
And of course, I will try to wake up more people whom you try to rob.
Meanwhile, as we can see, your bots can only do a cut and paste.
I hope that until RIPE NCC implements a secure transfer of IP addresses, all transfers on the territory of Ukraine will be closed.
Manipulation. RIPE NCC due diligence is secure enough now. There was no evidences for any forced transfer inside Ukraine. And for 1000% sure it is not a common situation that is too serious to close all Ukrainian transfers.
And for the last, I will remind your behavior, such as the style of your language and public treats as we found out not only to me. I don't know was it enough to be a crime in Europe, but for sure in any European country you will be kicked out with disgrace from the parliament just next day.
--
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, get a password reminder, or change your subscription options, please visit: https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ncc-services-wg
FAP_IMC <fap@fap.com.ua> wrote:
Cyber attacks are constantly taking place on enterprises of our critical infrastructure, our information space is overflowing with Russian propaganda and phishing scammers who are trying to extort the last money from the citizens of Ukraine.
Of course, and the government of Ukraine does not overflow its own citizens with propaganda at all.
At one time, the operators themselves proposed to block all AS of Russian operators.
Fake, only total garbage would propose such a thing. What happened is that the government threatened those who would not comply with the demands. Someone who runs a network and propose such a thing is either : 1. An incompetent 2. A crook 3. Both of the above
This is a separate topic for discussion, but the information domen RU that affected the citizens of our country has practically disappeared from the Internet space of Ukraine.
Please explain how a domain name "affects" the citizens of Ukraine? If citizens of Ukraine prefer to read/watch/retrieve/seek Kremlin propaganda over Ukrainian propaganda, or actually want both, it is their absolute right, and you have ZERO right to interfere with that and impose your diktat.
we already have cases when IP addresses, in the occupied territories of Ukraine, which are routed in the networks of Ukrainian operators, begin to be re-issued to other companies.
If it has already happened, then you can give us a concrete example.
I don't know why a person who escaped from a country where Russian missiles or Iranian drones fly every day is trying to deceive the RIPE NCC community.
Perhaps you forget to mention that Free and Democratic Ukraine forbids its male citizens from leaving the country and that perhaps, there are quite a few people who would not like to be trapped there. Perhaps you also forget to mention that Mr. Tulyev has been repeatedly threatened by the government of Ukraine. And for what reason? For providing free and unrestricted Internet access!
They are trying to accuse me of some kind of financial schemes.
There is no accusation there. We're demonstrating that: - The proposed solution will not achieve the stated purpose. - The proposed solution can be used for malicious purposes. - The Ukrainian government is not to be trusted.
I am sure that RIPE NCC will listen to the position of the public, namely those companies of residents of Ukraine that work on the territory of Ukraine.
Correct, and what will you do when you are upset because the outcome is not in your favor? Label them as terrorists and Kremlin collaborators?
Currently, rules are being developed for state institutions using IP addresses, but so far only for state institutions.
For as long as you keep your rules to yourself and ukrnadzor fans and leave real ISPs alone, that's fine by me. Also, those who whine about the IPv4 brokering business and yet have zero IPv6 connectivity, please let me laugh.
participants (4)
-
bravephoenixbird -
FAP_IMC -
Max Tulyev -
Paul BD