Re: [ncc-services-wg] ncc-services-wg Digest, Vol 118, Issue 23
Hello to everyone, Let me clarify my point of view. As we have already found out — the russians are the only ones who can steal Internet resources from Ukrainian companies. !! The only correct solution is to block RU from all opportunities in both ways: to receive and to offer Internet resources. !! It can be a temporary solution - until the end of the war and the complete withdrawal of all russians from Ukrainian territories, including Crimea, Donetsk and Luhansk regions. And don't say that it's not possible - RIPE has already made such restrictions for the whole country - Ukraine. What is the problem? Against Ukraine, RIPE NCC were not so afraid to act decisively and impose restrictions.
Stop transfer from UA to RU LIRs? Ok, but such transfers usual not to RU LIRs.
Do you mean that russians can steal resources by transferring them not to russian companies, but to European ones? Do you have such evidences that European companies are helping the criminal activities of russians?
Okay, but what territory of the UA at the time of confirmation is under occupation? And how RIPE NCC know it's surely?
Interesting things. Since 2014 russians occupied a huge part of Ukraine (Crimea, parts of Luhansk and Donetsk reg.) but RIPE didn't try to protect companies on occupied territories for more than 8 years. But now RIPE NCC would like to maniacally protect Ukrainian companies by blocking all transfers for all Ukraine. "I will kill you but protect you" — once again, thank you RIPE NCC very much for such "support" and "protection". Kind regards, Serhii
Message: 1 Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2022 01:19:40 +0200 From: Serg Galat <greysticky@gmail.com> To: ncc-services-wg@ripe.net Subject: Re: [ncc-services-wg] ncc-services-wg Digest, Vol 118, Issue 20 Message-ID: <91738161-33B7-479C-B73E-C0104913806B@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Dear colleague,
To my mind you don't see the latest RIPE event. Or didn't look carefully.
I'm fully agree with point 1 of your speech. That is, there is a problem. But there's no solution, or a legitimate solution.
Stop transfer from UA to RU LIRs? Ok, but such transfers usual not to RU LIRs. Accept transfers from UA to UA? Okay, but what territory of the UA at the time of confirmation is under occupation? And how RIPE NCC know it's surely?
And RIPE NCC is not blocking transfers by himself. The part of ua LIRs ask NCC to do that. Temporarily. Until this working group adopts the necessary changes to the relevant polices.
So no cynicism and naivety. Or something similar. That's if it's fair.
On 19 Dec 2022, at 23:09, Serhii Khomenko <khomenko.serhii.m@gmail.com> wrote:
I still will not get tired of being surprised at how naive people who live in civilized European countries. Although, maybe it's just a cynicism.
1. The only reason why we are discussing this topic (limiting the rights of Ukrainian companies) is the aggression of the russians. They are the only ones who can steal blocks of addresses in Ukraine, threatening the holders of Internet resources with death. Instead of punishing the aggressor, you implement restrictions on the victim of aggression. -- I assume that this is cynicism.
2. If you did not know, notary services are not for free. We are all Ukrainians now actively sponsoring the Armed Forces of Ukraine who are the only guarantor of the security of our companies. And instead of sending funds to strengthen the defense of Ukraine, you want to implement on us the obligation to pay an additional fees for the notary services. Thank you so much for your "support".
--
3. As we have already determined, the only reason for your concern and maniacal desire to violently protect the resources of Ukrainian companies is russians.
Also, everyone knows that hundreds of thousands of russists came not only to Ukraine, but also to dozens of countries of the European Union. And they can do whatever they want on the territory of the EU: the Skripal case, the Litvinenko case etc. The only difference is that Ukrainians have learned how to mix them with the soil. European countries do not know how to do this. So your companies are more vulnerable to the russians. Why don't you change the RIPE policy to limit the rights for companies throughout the territory of RIPE? Why don't you want to oblige European companies to pay for notary services during transfers as well or stop any transfers through all the RIPE countries at all?
-- Cynicism? Yes cynicism.
4. Why don't you want to implement a single effective way to protect all companies within the RIPE ?- blocking all transfers to a single criminal -- the russians??? And it will not be necessary to impose restrictions of the rights and freedoms for the European companies. But you won't do that - too much money comes from russists to RIPE, and everyone knows it.
- You know nothing about European values, unless these values are refined mercantile cynicism.
IMPLEMENT YOUR RESTRICTIONS FOR russia NOT FOR UKRAINE!! Or implement the same new policy for the whole RIPE region otherwise it will be discrimination of Ukraine based on national origin.
Kind regards, Serhii
Hello, so, as I understood, all this should be resolved by 31 december 2022? And my "stuck" transfers should be ok? I don't want any blocks or bans for my resources etc. Thanks. On Tue, Dec 20, 2022 at 1:56 PM Serhii Khomenko <khomenko.serhii.m@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello to everyone,
Let me clarify my point of view. As we have already found out — the russians are the only ones who can steal Internet resources from Ukrainian companies.
!! The only correct solution is to block RU from all opportunities in both ways: to receive and to offer Internet resources. !!
It can be a temporary solution - until the end of the war and the complete withdrawal of all russians from Ukrainian territories, including Crimea, Donetsk and Luhansk regions. And don't say that it's not possible - RIPE has already made such restrictions for the whole country - Ukraine. What is the problem? Against Ukraine, RIPE NCC were not so afraid to act decisively and impose restrictions.
Stop transfer from UA to RU LIRs? Ok, but such transfers usual not to RU LIRs.
Do you mean that russians can steal resources by transferring them not to russian companies, but to European ones? Do you have such evidences that European companies are helping the criminal activities of russians?
Okay, but what territory of the UA at the time of confirmation is under occupation? And how RIPE NCC know it's surely?
Interesting things. Since 2014 russians occupied a huge part of Ukraine (Crimea, parts of Luhansk and Donetsk reg.) but RIPE didn't try to protect companies on occupied territories for more than 8 years.
But now RIPE NCC would like to maniacally protect Ukrainian companies by blocking all transfers for all Ukraine. "I will kill you but protect you" — once again, thank you RIPE NCC very much for such "support" and "protection".
Kind regards, Serhii
Message: 1 Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2022 01:19:40 +0200 From: Serg Galat <greysticky@gmail.com> To: ncc-services-wg@ripe.net Subject: Re: [ncc-services-wg] ncc-services-wg Digest, Vol 118, Issue 20 Message-ID: <91738161-33B7-479C-B73E-C0104913806B@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Dear colleague,
To my mind you don't see the latest RIPE event. Or didn't look carefully.
I'm fully agree with point 1 of your speech. That is, there is a problem. But there's no solution, or a legitimate solution.
Stop transfer from UA to RU LIRs? Ok, but such transfers usual not to RU LIRs. Accept transfers from UA to UA? Okay, but what territory of the UA at the time of confirmation is under occupation? And how RIPE NCC know it's surely?
And RIPE NCC is not blocking transfers by himself. The part of ua LIRs ask NCC to do that. Temporarily. Until this working group adopts the necessary changes to the relevant polices.
So no cynicism and naivety. Or something similar. That's if it's fair.
On 19 Dec 2022, at 23:09, Serhii Khomenko <khomenko.serhii.m@gmail.com> wrote:
I still will not get tired of being surprised at how naive people who live in civilized European countries. Although, maybe it's just a cynicism.
1. The only reason why we are discussing this topic (limiting the rights of Ukrainian companies) is the aggression of the russians. They are the only ones who can steal blocks of addresses in Ukraine, threatening the holders of Internet resources with death. Instead of punishing the aggressor, you implement restrictions on the victim of aggression. -- I assume that this is cynicism.
2. If you did not know, notary services are not for free. We are all Ukrainians now actively sponsoring the Armed Forces of Ukraine who are the only guarantor of the security of our companies. And instead of sending funds to strengthen the defense of Ukraine, you want to implement on us the obligation to pay an additional fees for the notary services. Thank you so much for your "support".
--
3. As we have already determined, the only reason for your concern and maniacal desire to violently protect the resources of Ukrainian companies is russians.
Also, everyone knows that hundreds of thousands of russists came not only to Ukraine, but also to dozens of countries of the European Union. And they can do whatever they want on the territory of the EU: the Skripal case, the Litvinenko case etc. The only difference is that Ukrainians have learned how to mix them with the soil. European countries do not know how to do this. So your companies are more vulnerable to the russians. Why don't you change the RIPE policy to limit the rights for companies throughout the territory of RIPE? Why don't you want to oblige European companies to pay for notary services during transfers as well or stop any transfers through all the RIPE countries at all?
-- Cynicism? Yes cynicism.
4. Why don't you want to implement a single effective way to protect all companies within the RIPE ?- blocking all transfers to a single criminal -- the russians??? And it will not be necessary to impose restrictions of the rights and freedoms for the European companies. But you won't do that - too much money comes from russists to RIPE, and everyone knows it.
- You know nothing about European values, unless these values are refined mercantile cynicism.
IMPLEMENT YOUR RESTRICTIONS FOR russia NOT FOR UKRAINE!! Or implement the same new policy for the whole RIPE region otherwise it will be discrimination of Ukraine based on national origin.
Kind regards, Serhii
--
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participants (2)
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Serhii Khomenko -
Артем Зубков