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Re: Bangemann Commission Document available from the Web
by Dave Morton 15 Jul '94

15 Jul '94

Bernhard, I'd be more worried from an Internet perspective about all the talk in the report of a "single regulatory framework" and then the "European Basic Services Forum" (in the context of the Internet at least) seems to me to be more or less equal to some of the ideas behind the EOF initiative. Dave

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Re: Bangemann Commission Document available from the Web
by Dave Morton 15 Jul '94

15 Jul '94

> >PS: Recevied some really cool tarrifs a few days ago from DBP Telekom > >for participation in the 18 PTO ATM pilot. Effectively they prohibit > >participation if you're in DE. > >this, of course, is the least funny situation in europe Agreed... >the DBP are legally in breach of several EU directives So what's new in the EU !! >in one of our race projects, their tarrif for 34Mbps access was over >20 times that of the next most expensive, and app[roaching 35 times >that of the equivalent tariffed uk service Recent comment supposedly from a German university professor - "well me might be able to use it for 10 minutes a day between here and France if we're lucky !!" >irrelevant of ATM, they are a disgrace to modern markets and are a >restraint of trade to network subscribers and other providers who >could easily blow them away if they didn't have a protectionist >government > >i find their attitude deeply offensive. > >seriously. No need to preach to the converted... > jon > dave

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Re: Bangemann Commission Document available from the Web
by Dave Morton 15 Jul '94

15 Jul '94

> >THE VERY SAME THING IS HAPPENING NOW. YOU WONT GET ANY MONEY FROM NO > >PUBLIC FUNDS FOR NETWORKING IF YOUR REQUEST DOES NOT CONTAIN THE WORD > >ATM ON EVERY SECOND LINE !! > >I propose a research program on an EU wide banking network using TCP/IP >to connect all the Automatic Teller Machines together and to homes so >that the user can pay for video on demand, carry out home shopping and >even particpate in e-mail and multimedia conferences about >Another Terrible Mistake by the EC. Pharmacists in hospitals around >the EU wil lbe able to prescribe drugs such as >Adenozine Tri-Molybdomate, and high-school children and teachers >will be abe to undertake Aptitude Testing and Marking with >off-the-shelf technology such as cisco, wellfleet, proteon, and Spider >Systems (an EU based company, not an American Technology Magnate) >can provide right now > > jon >do i get the money?:-) > Jon, nice proposal ! But you only get the cash if you don't forget your PIN code :-). To be serious for a second (!), even the commission must realise at this stage that wide-area ATM is not quite upon us yet - mabye by the time the report actually gets implemented. By then, we'll probably be picking up our pensions anyway (still from the hole in the wall). Dave PS: Recevied some really cool tarrifs a few days ago from DBP Telekom for participation in the 18 PTO ATM pilot. Effectively they prohibit participation if you're in DE.

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Apologies: Readable Call for Papers CNRE
by kiers＠rare.nl 14 Jul '94

14 Jul '94

Dear all, Apologies if you receive this more than once. Unfortunately a binhexed version went out previously, to make amends you will find the readable information below. Kind regards, Judith Kiers =================================================================== C A L L F O R P A P E R S for Computer Networks for Research in Europe (CNRE) Journal - C O N T I N U O U S - COMPUTER NETWORKS FOR RESEARCH IN EUROPE is a new, joint publication by RARE and EARN. It is published as a quarterly supplement to the Elsevier North-Holland journal "Computer Networks and ISDN Systems". The editorial board consists of high-level representatives from national and international research networking organizations and is chaired by Tomaz Kalin, RARE Secretary-General and Paul Bryant, EARN Secretary-General. The colofon reads as follows: "Scope COMPUTER NETWORKS for RESEARCH in EUROPE is a publication vehicle for coverage of topics of interest to those involved in the area. The audience includes staff from networking service providers of all sizes as well as application developers, policy makers and representatives of funding bodies, advanced user groups and standards organizations. Subject coverage Material on aspects of design, implementation, use and management of computer networks for reseach and education. Specifically included are non-technical topics related to economic, legal and regulatory issues and social impact of using network services in the research and education community. In addition, both RARE (Réseaux Associés pour la Recherche Européenne) and EARN (European Academic and Research Network) report on developments in their organizations. Types of contributions considered The purpose of the journal is to publish complete papers covering a specific topic or project of practical use to interested readers. The journal is meant to be a source of information on all aspects of computer networks for research and education and will also include news items in addition to the regular contributions discussed above." - Submission of material - Preferred format for submitting papers: RTF or ascii text (+ separate graphs and tables). All material will be formatted in a standard "Elsevier" layout. Preferred length: around 3500 words. For more detailed information on submission procedures send a message to cnre(a)rare.nl. - Review procedure - The editorial board will review submitted material for publication or appoint expert reviewers to do the review on its behalf.

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Re: Bangemann Commission Document available from the Web
by Dave Morton 14 Jul '94

14 Jul '94

>> BUT remember what happened when an EU initiative was not market driven. >> Remember GOSSIP. I have a tender request in front of me from a Government >> department which demands GOSIP compliance. They want some PCs on a LAN >> connected to a data-base UNIX engine with access to JANET. All because of EU >> legislation attempting to lead rather respond to the market. With IP the >> project would be trivial. Otherwise where do I get GOSIP software for a PC? >> I can just about get it for X.400 and X.29 but FTAM? You will also need a > >My team has ported Isode FTAM to DOS for X.25 over ethernet based on >the edinburgh rainbow software. It will also interoperate with dynamic >address mapping by IS10030 (SNARE) to allow for easyer administration >on a local ethernet. You can get the software if you like (i think). We don't >do UK specific standards though, like JANET name resolution, but that shouldn't >be so much of a problem. >Ok, probably not the answer that you expected. You see, this kind of >revelation ("We do OSI, We implement OSI and we even do it for DOS *yuck*) >is not only offending to you but embarrasing to me too. So better forget >it and go back to the brave new world of the Internet. Toerless - are you admitting your efforts were not market driven either ? Dave

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Re: Funding models and such
by Geert Jan de Groot 14 Jul '94

14 Jul '94

For people that cannot wait... ------- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 14 Jul 1994 06:13:11 +1000 From: Geoff Huston <G.Huston(a)aarnet.edu.au> To: GeertJan.deGroot(a)ripe.net cc: gih(a)nico.aarnet.edu.au Subject: Re: Funding models and such Geert, I'm going to put my overheads and commentary up on the web in the next few days - till then feel free to disseminate the slides in postscript format (all 8Mb!) ftp://ftp.aarnet.edu.au/pub/inet/WkShop.ps I've also got a policy talk that I gave at INET'94 which is also relevant to the discussion about government participation and roles in Internets today: http://www.aarnet.edu.au/aarnet/organisation/gih/inet-94.html Its worth a look as it covers the background to the currnet debate. and yes feel free to include me in the discussion! I've gotta catch a plane in 5 minutes - so I'll get back to you in a couple of days - good to hear from you cheers, Geoff ------- End of Forwarded Message

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Action items - JULY reminder
by Anne Lord 13 Jul '94

13 Jul '94

RIPE 18 actions status report - First reminder (JULY) ------- Below is the list of action items from the RIPE meeting (and previously). The actions are grouped into two different categories: "Done" and "Open". If you are on the list with an action against your name, would you please reply confirming the status of that action : ie. whether it has been "Done" or whether it is still "Open", with an expected approx date for completion, if possible. The next reminder will be sent out mid August (probably when everyone is on holiday) and the last one, one week before the RIPE meeting (just in the nick of time). Anne in hot & sunny Amsterdam. ----------- Action List - RIPE 18 ===================== 1. Done Action: 16.6 Daniel Karrenberg Why return unused IP address space and be a good network citizen. Daniel to find volunteer to continue the work - obsolete. Action:18.2 NCC Draft new standard European Internet Network Number Application Form (formerly ripe-107) in light of recommendations from the working group. Action: 18.6 NCC Set-up a mailing list for the connectivity WG. Action: 18.8 NCC Fold in comments from routing-wg to the ripe-81++ draft, send to RIPE list and release final version - June 28th. Action: 18.11 NCC Put A. Romao's paper "Taking Care of your Domain" into the RIPE document store as a RIPE document. 2. Not Done Action: 15.10 Daniel Karrenberg To propose new tags "created" and "assigned" to the database working group for consideration - pending. Action: 16.18 NCC Try to actually get the synchronisation of the various database going, using the recently agreed DB Exchange Format. Action is dependant on the NIC handle - pending. Action:17.1 Glenn Kowack Volunteered to write a paper for discussion which would focus on a future funding model for the RIPE NCC. Action:17.7 Wilfried Woeber, NCC To produce the necessary documentation for the new DB software. Action: 17.8 NCC To update and re-circulate the RIPE-Handle proposal and then go ahead with the implementation. Action: 17.11 NCC Investigate and propose a syntax-checking facility for the new database software. Action: 17.15 NCC Propose and implement a mechanism to properly keep track of individual updates of objects and automatic merge/ modification operations. Action:17.17 Bernhard Stockman Draft a new version of the EEPG Terms of Reference and distribute this on the mailing list ASAP. Action:17.18 Bernhard Stockman Draft a new version of the EEPG Workplan and distribute this on the EEPG mailing list ASAP. Action: 17.20 Oleg Tabarovsky To collect data on external lines and restrictions applying to each line that will form part of the Russian backbone. Send details to <oleg(a)ussr.eu.net> Action: 17.21 Rob Blokzijl Summarise in a paper discussions on RIPE re-org and publish before next meeting. Action:18.1 Daniel Karrenberg Convey RIPE's concern at the disparity in criteria with respect to IP network number applications to the InterNIC - ongoing. Action:18.3 NCC Investigate monthly publication of error files on reverse zone files, similar to the host count error files. Action:18.4 Mike Norris Initiate discussion w.r.t the funding and charging for the service of a Local IR on the Local-IR discussion list and aim to summarise the discussions by way of a draft recommendation. Action: 18.5 Wilfried Woeber Post the CEEnet Initiative maps to the RIPE FTP server. Action: 18.7 Elise Gerich To supply a list of keywords allowed that can be used when querying the database. Action: 18.9 Cristina Vistoli, Ewald Jenisch, Michael Ernst (Hans Frese) To convert from ripe-60 to ripe-81 before July 1st, 1994. Action:18.10 Francis Dupont Circulate a proposed new domain object with the list of attributes necessary, marking others optional, maybe obsolete them in the future. Update to RIPE-049. Action: 18.12 Erik-Jan Bos Set up Workplan, Terms of Reference and Euro-FAQ, to be send to the mailing list. Tony Bates said he could help EJB on the FAQ. Action:18.13 Erik-Jan Bos Send to the mailing list where to find the worldwide PS file (done through these minutes). Action: 18.14 All members of the Mbone WG See if there is a local Mbone mailing list in your country, if not, create one and add this list to the European list, so that European information is passed on. Action: 18.15 Erik-Jan Bos Start up a central European Mbone FTP server. Action: 18.16 Everyone in the Mbone WG Send in your Mbone maps to Erik-Jan Bos. Action: 18.17 RIPE Chairs Promote a more aggressive "outreach" programme io introduce and encourage new service providers to join RIPE. Action: 18.18 RIPE Chairs Continue the RIPE restructuring discussions on the <new-ripe(a)ripe.net> mailing list focusing on restructuring the technical work of RIPE. Action:18.19 RIPE Chairs Develop a draft model for "new-RIPE" by the next RIPE meeting in September, with the final report ready by January meeting in 1995. ripe-m-18.txt

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Re: Looking for funding examples
by goldstein＠nsf.gov 13 Jul '94

13 Jul '94

Wed, 13 Jul 94 14: 49:25 +0200. <Pine.3.89.9407131430.A6126-0100000(a)knidos.cc.metu.edu.tr> Date: Wed, 13 Jul 94 08:22:08 EDT Sender: sgoldste(a)nsf.gov Folks, If these considerations are at all widespread, as Attila suggests, INET'95 would welcome a paper (or two, or three) for the Regional Track. In fact, if there is sufficient content, we could devote an entire session in the regional track to the matter (I am on the track leaders committee with particular emphasis, under John Hine's leadership, on the regional track.) Hank, Attla, would either of you be willing to organize such a session? If anybody would care to submit a paper, we are accepting (early) abstracts...(^_^) Thanks, Steve G. The message I received from Attila Ozgit said: > On Sun, 10 Jul 1994, Hank Nussbacher wrote: > > > In an effort to convince our government to fund Internet efforts to a > > greater level, I have been asked to provide examples of other countries > > where government agencies provide funding for the Internet. > > > > I would like to hear from as many national networks of your experiences > > in this. > > > > - What government agency provided the funding? > > As a result of a joint effort of Middle East Technical University (METU) > and Turkish Technical and Scientific Research Council (TUBITAK), funds have > been allocated under TUBITAK's yearly budget. > > > - How many years did this funding cover? > > Initially for only one year (Allocations are done for each year.) > > > - How much money was given? > > 250,000.- USD/yr. > > > - Was the money provided strictly for universities or universities > > and R&D or for all of the Internet? > > Initially for universities; now for all Internet > > > - What was bought with the money? T1 lines to the USA? T1 lines national > ly? > > ATM equipment and lines? NIC services? > > Router(s); 64 Kbps line to NSF/ICM in Washington DC. > > > - Anything else you would like to add? > > > > Hank: Would you mind sending me those answers from different countries that > you could get. We are experiencing similar problems here. Sometimes > international evidence (or examples) does help alot. Doesn't It? > > Thx, > > -attila

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Second EOF meeting
by Peter Lothberg 13 Jul '94

13 Jul '94

Draft Agenda 2nd EOF Meeting ============================ Date: 15 July 1994 Time: 10 AM Place: Transpac Montparnasse tower 26th floor, 33, avenue du Maine 75755 Paris Cedex 15 Host: Gilles ANTOINE Version 2.0 1. Traffic and Routing Exchange Models between Providers <This is about makeing template agreements about routing and traffic exchanges between providers which may (but do not have to) be used when providers connect to each other.> Keith Mitchell Glenn Kowack 2. Connectivity from Europe to other continents via the US <This is about how this will work with the new NSFnet architecture> Bernhard Stockman 3. What role will the US NAP's play in the Global Internet <This is about what the NAPS will look initially and what they do and don't to Internet users outside the US.> Peter Lothberg 4. Routing Registry Architectures This is an update about Routing Registries around the world, how they work and how they are being used. Then a discussion on - how to use RRs to provide routing stability in Europe - how to operate RRs (who does it, who pays, ...) - future developments Desired outcome: - better information of those present - feedback from ISPs to PRIDE project and NCC Daniel Karrenberg 5. D-GIX issues, a common interface between NSP's <Global routing/traffic exchange issues, how to implement the border between NSP's from a routing and troubleshooting perspective.> Peter Lothberg 6. CIDR aggregation of larger blocks <How do we continue the CIDR process in order to do a second level aggregation? Discussion on what it would take to announce 193/8 as one block.> Peter Lothberg 7. EOF Charter <This is about what the EOF is and how it relates to other activities in the area such as RIPE> Glenn Kowack

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Bangemann Commission Document available from the Web
by Nadine Grange 13 Jul '94

13 Jul '94

The Bangemann Commission Document, "Europe and the global information society, Recommendations to the European Council" is available from the Web at: http://www.earn.net/EC/bangemann.html Please forward this information. /Nadine

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